47 points•samch•about 4 hours ago•24 comments•

24 comments

kaysonabout 3 hours ago
It's even worse than just the same flight number. Both were at PHX, one landing, one taking off at the same time. Kudos to a clever ATC for preventing what could've been a catastrophe: https://youtu.be/93lLXNsWp9Q
Sophiraabout 3 hours ago
The YouTube video you link to is actually about a separate incident from the one described in the article. The video is about an incident involving two AAL2482s near Phoenix; the article is about an incident involving two AA5083s near Providence.

It's the same idea though; one was inbound, the other outbound, and ATC had to distinguish between the two.

[edit: Corrected locations.]

oatmeal1about 1 hour ago
The probability of it becoming a catastrophe was infinitesimally low with the existence of TCAS.
ameliusabout 2 hours ago
Falsehoods airlines believe about flight numbers.
readthenotes1about 1 hour ago
Iirc, AA/Sabre knows that a flight identifier is actually carrier+flight number+origin airport+departure date.

But who all calls someone by their full name all the time??

vessenesabout 1 hour ago
Reminds me of the excellent, and frequently surprising https://flightaware.engineering/falsehoods-programmers-belie..., which includes surprising false statements like:

“Everything that has an ICAO code is on Earth”, and “flights are at most a few days long”. The whole list makes you despair of structuring any data, ever.

BJones12about 2 hours ago
> American assigns the same flight number to the outbound and return services, with the same aircraft typically operating both legs.

So they could just not do that.

expedition32about 2 hours ago
Maybe they ran out of numbers I mean there are only so many...
chneuabout 2 hours ago
We need IPv6 for aircraft identification.

Lol

gausswhoabout 3 hours ago
I'd like to hear more from someone in the industry about the resolution to this problem. As I understand it, we're trading a small non-zero risk of mistaken identity for the streamlined communication of using four digits rather than five (which carries its own non-zero benefit to safety). This has become a problem because airline consolidation means some of them operate so many flights per day that their limited pool of numbers dictate that they reuse them for either direction.

Could we resolve this by swapping one number for a letter? 26 options instead of 10 raises the pool substantially. Letters A-J indicate inbound, K-Z outbound? Or westbound/eastbound.

ycanabout 2 hours ago
Alphanumeic call signs are already used around the world [0], it's just that the US (like many other aviation fields) is behind the times.

[0] https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/aviation-explainer-series...

xenadu02about 3 hours ago
The format is SSIM defined by IATA - the international association of transport airlines. It specifies two letter airline code followed by four digit flight.

I'm sure various ATC systems also assume this.

Changing it would be an industry-wide effort.

Read the full thread on Hacker News →

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