59 points•Anon84•about 3 hours ago•34 comments•

34 comments

baron816about 1 hour ago
Summary of why sovereign wealth funds are generally a bad idea: the governments don’t like to do things that could potentially harm their investments. If a government has large stakes in cigarette companies, they’re going to be resistant to regulate them.

There’s also plenty of opportunity for corruption. But even with safeguards, there’s going to be opportunities to steer investment towards favored companies and industries and away from those that oppose the administration or otherwise do things the administration doesn’t like (think of efforts to divest from Israel or fossil fuel companies).

“Just invest in the S&P”. Something like this would give substantial power to the index makers. But it also gives preference to already huge companies. Small, unlisted companies would be indirectly penalized by having to compete against companies with government funding.

aeternum39 minutes ago
In the grand scheme of things, the gov claiming a perpetual 21%+ of all income of AI (all) companies is not all that different from owning a small percent of said AI companies. The financials and even incentives are basically the same.

It's somewhat entertaining to watch both sides argue about this as if it's some major difference when both are actually aligned on wanting bigger gov and more gov ownership/control of corps (one party via taxes the other wants it direct).

jfyi27 minutes ago
> gov ownership/control of corps

Corporations are literally government sponsored entities. Where do you think they get their limited liability and separate legal personhood from?

We should own a piece of every single one for that service we provide.

jfyi39 minutes ago
> the governments don’t like to do things that could potentially harm their investments. If a government has large stakes in cigarette companies, they’re going to be resistant to regulate them.

The ideal in a democracy would be that we behave as adults and make the decision where to draw the lines.

...and yeah, corruption is a problem, but it's going to find a way regardless of what we throw at it. We would be better off handling the existing corruption than worrying about some hypothetical future corruption as a reason we can't try new things.

baron81618 minutes ago
I think what we’ve found with the current administration is that people will use every last surface for corruption and power that they can. The more you opportunities you give the government to be corrupt, the more corrupt they’re going to be.
FrustratedMonky5 minutes ago
There's a reason every country with a sovereign wealth fund is a dictatorship, its a really handy way to launder money, steal. Which is why Trump wants it.
carefree-bob1 minute ago
Norway is a dictatorship?
redwood26 minutes ago
Doesn't need to be the S&P. Can simply be the entire market float market share weighted
baron81617 minutes ago
That’s still providing an implicit subsidy to listed corporations
js73js8about 2 hours ago
> A isn't X – it's Y
keiferski4 minutes ago
Isn't it usually "it's not just x, it's y"? As in, it's X but even more than X.

The title has the opposite meaning: it's not X, but it's Y.

rtkweabout 2 hours ago
It's common in AI writing because it's common in human writing. Juxtaposition is a useful rhetorical flourish.
the_sleaze_about 1 hour ago
Only sort of true.

Consider the OpenAI case of "goblins". The models overfit to a specific type of output. Goblins was a specific case of this type and needed to be corrected.

https://openai.com/index/where-the-goblins-came-from/

> We unknowingly gave particularly high rewards for metaphors with creatures. From there, the goblins spread.

axusabout 2 hours ago
Fashions change; ideas that look AI-generated are out of fashion right now.

I've never really cared about fashion.

add-sub-mul-divabout 2 hours ago
If it was used as sparingly, appropriately, and skillfully in AI writing as in human writing then AI writing wouldn't stand out as so mediocre and cringe.
tom_36 minutes ago
Yeah, the subject is AI, so you try to get a crashingly obvious AI trope in there somewhere. Those are the rules.

(Disclaimer: didn't read the article. It's paywalled.)

dist-epochabout 1 hour ago
In general news paper article writers don't pick the title of their own article, it's someone else picking it for engagement (maybe using AI).

Also, FT is too big to not be aware of AI writing, and to not have internal checks (Pangram, ...)

AI speak infects human language now, people start to talk like LLMs.

jfyiabout 1 hour ago
People already talked like LLMs, how else would they have learned to talk like that?

"It isn't x, its y" was a common device before, AI has just highlighted it's use. Em dashes on the other hand are the devil's work.

velcrovanabout 2 hours ago
I can’t read the article. Do they explain how it’s more imperialist than what we have now?

Using capital ownership to distribute the proceeds of an industry whose raw material was the creative output of everyone everywhere … seems like the neatest and most obvious possible solution to AI displacement and provenance. But I can see how it might make a few dozen people less likely to be billionaires.

StableAlkyneabout 2 hours ago
AI;DR* they want to build data centers in other countries that are less able to resist their construction. This consumes water and electricity of the host county. The central thesis is that if the less-than-willing exploitation of foreign resources for the enrichment of the more powerful country is imperialism, then this is a form of imperialism.

* The clunky turns of phrase and jarring introduction of analogies reads strongly of Claude to me, at least

MadrasThornabout 1 hour ago
anything that gives US an advantage in any market/competitive arena is basically imperialist.
alephnerdabout 2 hours ago
Gift article - https://giftarticle.ft.com/giftarticle/actions/redeem/71bd10...

But basically, the argument is that a government shouldn't accrue and own appreciating assets mixed with AI skepticism.

velcrovanabout 2 hours ago
Thanks. I'm astonished how poorly written and poorly argued the piece is. No discussion or even mention of existing SWFs. Trying to frame SWFs as something leftists should oppose because of… some vague hand-waving about an Edwardian policy?

SWFs are a great tool for reducing inequality and influencing corporate governance. see, e.g. https://peoplespolicyproject.org/project/creating-an-alaska-...

Frickenabout 1 hour ago
The purpose of any technology is to expand one's powers, and whatever those powers expand to is conquested. Bronze was imperialist but iron was more imperialist, and gunpowder was more imperialist than that. Oil was even more imperialist and now chips and AI are having a go at it. Even the harnessing of fire and the cultivation of spoken language was imperialist, and a necessary step towards today's AI boom. It's the the latest ring to rule them all.
PAPPPmAc44 minutes ago
Interestingly to your example, there seems to be a rough consensus that the bronze age collapse (~12th century BC) was related to the fact that iron production was less centralized than bronze, which required multiple long-distance supply chains that could be monopolized by regional powers. Different folks point the causality in different directions.

Some technologies are inherently more centralizing, some are less so.

I agree that most technologies can be applied for imperialistic interests, and the tech space is full of things that seemed decentralizing and have since been captured, but it's not quite law.

IC manufacturing is basically a modern global palace economy full of shipping and single-player choke points and large capital investments, so it leans hard to the centralizing side. It's less clear that AI will work that way, if it turns out that it is relatively practical to do useful work on locally hosted models it might end up being somewhat decentralizing.

Or, we'll get technological and/or regulatory capture, end up paying rents to technofeudalist douchebags with data centers and proprietary models who bribe governments and peek at user behavior and try to use their already vast resources to preemptively capture any value before anyone else can, until the next major perturbation.

inshardabout 1 hour ago
That paywall is techno imperialism
alephnerdabout 2 hours ago
Well yeah, hard power is a major impetus behind sovereign wealth funds - be they ADIA, Temasek, Master Trust, QIA, PIF, CIC, etc.

But this is the world we live in.

If you put your head in the sand, you become the EU - squeezed by trade wars against China and the US with two large scale conventional wars within your near abroad.

Read the full thread on Hacker News →

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