94 points•polygot•1 day ago•46 comments•

46 comments

No one mentioning Decisions API?

Feels huge. Sounds like Luna on their Ultrafast infra.

I did some internal benchmarking and found that GPT 6 Luna in batch mode at 20 records per batch was about 1.6x faster at 1.2x the cost of Jev with no tradeoff in accuracy. Tuning it up/down would make it faster per-record while also reducing the cost (assuming accuracy holds). Though this was only useful for offline processing.

dudus1 day ago
It's another Jev copy, like we've seen so many over the last few weeks. But with no benchmarks or price comparison, which likely means it doesn't compare that well.

    > But with no benchmarks or price comparison, which likely means it doesn't compare that well.
Doubt that's the case; this was only the announcement and the API isn't even released yet. As I noted, my own testing using a batching strategy (nothing more than "read 20 lines from this file instead of reading 1 at a time") yielded ~the same accuracy on an 800 row dataset we have with ~1.6x the throughput (at only batch_size=20) and 1.2x the cost. Didn't tune to find accuracy dropoff by batch size, but it's easy to see that the decision capability was there (understood that it's not the same without the probabilities, but even without it, the classifications were nearly identical).
ramoz1 day ago
Sign-in with sub accounts seems big. This is how I thought this was always supposed to be - the providers acting more like an OS/ecosystem-enabler.

Extensions into codex also seem cool.

The provider also eating the application stack at the same time, doesn't make too much sense. I don't want my team going all in on one provider versus the other. (things like the docs/slides/sites).

softwaredoug1 day ago
The big takeaway is they announced decision model API for Luna
They say it's built on Luna, which costs $0.10M/in, vs Jev which only costs $0.04M/in, which is interesting ...

Based on how fast they rushed out a competitor (and the anti-Jev astroturfing), it seems that Jev is much more of a threat to OpenAI than they want to admit. Other than coding it seems the other high volume use case for LLMs is business automation, and for a lot of that all you need/want is indeed just a decision/classifier model.

htrp1 day ago
wonder how the jev team feels here
brandall101 day ago
Investors/founders are likely horrified to discover there is no industrial-scale moat in no time at all... they probably expected to have at least a 2-3 month window to capture market share and value.

I suspect Jev was intended to be an acquisition play and instead OAI said "nah, we're good" literally 2 weeks to the day after its launch. Anthropic and the Chinese labs are almost certainly soon to follow.

They're rumored to be in the early stages of a billion dollar round to value the company at $10B. Best of luck with that.

Validated, envigorated ?

The reaction to Jev has been huge, as has been OpenAI's speed here is announcing a "not quite ready yet" competitor... the idea of Jev is one of those "Doh! Why didn't I think of it!" moments ... in retrospect it's obvious that business automation is all about decision making and the market for this is massive. Up until now most people just saw this as a use case for LLMs, until TypeSafe/Jev came along and said "actually you don't need an LLM for this ...".

I'm sure TypeSafe realized the idea is a winner and expected competition, although maybe not quite so fast?

The question now is how seriously OpenAI take this, and are they willing to compete with Jev on price, thereby massively reducing Luna margins (which OpenAI's "Decisions API" is based on)? I guess if you can't make $0.10/M for Luna, then $0.04/M is better than just giving that market to a competitor, assuming you're profitable at $0.04/M.

copperx1 day ago
Flattered, I assume.
None of this matters. The real news is the upcoming changes to the subscriptions.

OpenAI just rugpulled $200 plan users by slashing their usage in half and releasing a new $500 plan with the old usage plus a little more. Amazing, isn't it?

Half the usage for the same price, or slightly more usage for 250% of the price! Are you not entertained?!

alexslobodnikabout 11 hours ago
Why is everything called a rug.

Unless someone signed a long term contract I don't see anything wrong with this.

matheusmoreiraabout 6 hours ago
How is it not a rugpull?

They halved the usage of existing Pro 20x subscribers, then created a new plan with the old usage.

Just because it's not literally illegal doesn't mean it's not a rugpull.

____tom____1 day ago
They have to stop subsidizing at some point!

And they still aren't there, I bet.

coverbandabout 23 hours ago
I love the fact that they're advertising the latest Codex Cli while most Windows users had to rollback/downgrade to an older version because of the annoying excessive terminal screen flashing issue (https://github.com/openai/codex/issues/48074)

(I see a newer version was posted an hour ago. Let's see if the issue is now fixed...)

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