Socialism's appeal is at a new high, but it remains less popular than capitalism and well below free enterprise.

70 points•karakoram•7 days ago•104 comments•

104 comments

OhMeadhbh7 days ago
As David Graeber once said: "The ultimate hidden truth of the world is that it is something that we make, and could just as easily make differently."

I believe this, which I supposed makes me a Graeberite. Graeberian? Graeberista?

swed4206 days ago
Go with Graeberite, because Graeber was right
exolymph6 days ago
"just as easily" — hmm, no, I think not
adverbly7 days ago
/cries-because-georgism-is-the-GOAT-and-its-not-even-on-the-list
nwah17 days ago
Redistribution that enhances production rather than stifling it. Which provides justice rather than creating injustice. A great idea to bury under dust for centuries.
OhMeadhbh7 days ago
well... georgism is sort of orthogonal to capitalism and socialism. You could have a georgist tax regime in both capitalist and socialist utopia.

But... yes... it would be great if enough people knew about Henry George and Georgism that the Gallup people thought it was worthwhile to put it on a survey.

And allow me to bemoan the current state of affairs where the definitions of capitalism and socialism used by most Americans are defined by tribal communities whose (sub)social order depends on the in-crowd toeing a particular party line with respect to whom is allowed to extract rent, set prices, rent and tax rates. Which is to say, if you're comfortably making seven figures on your constellation of payday loan offices, you probably a fan of the status quo.

For my right-wing nut-job friends, remember, there are "socialist" countries like Sweden, Denmark and (arguably) Canada which are perfectly pleasant. Venezuela and Cuba's problems aren't due to their "socialist" nature, but to wide-spread corruption and oligarchy. Keynes (and even Marx) had interesting things to say, though doctrinaire adoption of political and economic philosophy from previous centuries is not likely a good idea.

For my left-wing pinko friends, remember, not all "capitalism" is regressive. Even places like Sweden, Denmark and Canada have a form of capitalism despite being mildly constrained by collective action. Hayak had interesting things to say, though doctrinaire adoption of political and economic philosophy from previous centuries is not likely a good idea.

Stop me before I mention Modern Monetary Theory.

adverbly7 days ago
> Stop me before I mention Modern Monetary Theory.

Au contraire! Please continue!

thrance7 days ago
Georgism is a tax policy, not a full ideology. It can't be implemented under capitalism, because the capitalists would never allow it. And it would ve redundant under working socialism.
recursivedoubts7 days ago
Georgism and social credit (canadian, not chinese) are two ideas that the elites better start considering unless they want france 1789 vibes again.

As I say to my left-leaning friends: hey, you know what we should socialize? The money supply. (My right-leaning friends aren't ready for that conversation yet.)

throwawayqqq117 days ago
As your left-leaning friend, i agree with you comrad, you are talking about MMT, which got already meantioned in here.
anramon7 days ago
It's late half of 19th century all over again.
jamiesonbecker7 days ago
It's Russia 1917 or Cuba 1959 all over again.

But it'll be different this time! Right?!

throwawayqqq117 days ago
This time, europe is already lost /s
GlibMonkeyDeath7 days ago
The survey asked:

"Just off the top of your head, would you say you have a positive or negative image of each of the following? (Small business, Free enterprise, Capitalism, Socialism, Big business)"

So these terms are left as self-explanatory. In the US, "socialism" covers a huge amount of ground (from any government program at all, all the way to Soviet style communism.) So who knows what items people were picking.

One thing that is interesting, look at the gender and age splits in the above link for "socialism" and "capitalism" - 15-20 point divide between genders overall, and I bet the split is even more stark among young people.

water-data-dude7 days ago
I think keeping the questions simple is for the best though. If they included more explanation or a definition for each term, it might inject bias.
mig397 days ago
I live in Canada, where even our right-wing parties are in favour of public education and free health care. I guess that makes us all socialists.
jimt12347 days ago
In the US, we hate socialism for everyone else, but love it for ourselves. I've talked to many pro-Trump, MAGA folks who ranted about 'welfare queens', yet they're collecting SSDI (Social Security Disability Insurance - aka, money from the government). "That's different!"
karakoram7 days ago
I find the farmers to be the funniest. Like without their stimmy cheques and subsidies they'll all be homeless. For some reason not many farmers call this socialism.

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